Tucked amid the financial doom and gloom this week was this annoying tidbit. Apparently some twat in Norway has decided to run his mouth some more about how Apple is required to make iTunes Store purchases interoperable with their competitors’ products…or else. I’m sorry, but this sort of shit enrages me. I am a advocate of consumer rights; but, once upon a time, “consumer rights” meant things like “your car doesn’t explode,” and “your food isn’t poison.” Not the current refrain of “wah, gimme what I want” that seems to be synonymous with the phrase now.
Here’s the facts for the simpletons out there who don’t get it. You have no right to demand that every thing that a corporation sells you be provided in any format that strikes your fancy. If you don’t like iPods, then buy your music from any of the dozens of alternate sources and play it on whatever the fuck you like.
And, in particular to Bjoern Erik Thon, fuck you in your frost-bitten, entitletard ear.
So Thon (for he is the mighty hammer) fucks up iPod goodness for the rest of his frostbitten colleagues in the north of northwards. He’s going to get a lot of thanks from the penguins and yaks. Because walruses are big fans of the Zune (some have tatoos)and they are a key demographic for something or other… no, ran out of bile, whatever, something, something, fuck off.
If Norway has it’s way, Microsoft will have trouble with the Zune store as it will also need to be cross platform. As it currently stands, the Zune store is even more limited than the iTunes Music Store.
I don’t really understand what Norway is trying to accomplish here. Seems like a bunch of BS to me.
Leaving aside that Apple isn’t requiring DRM in the iTMS, the music companies are…
Dude, he lives in the country that created LUTEFISK.
with that in mind, anything Norwegians do makes sense.
I sort of feel sorry for him, actually. His hands are tied: he cannot directly sue the labels who are ultimately responsible for the DRM mess, but he’s obligated by job title to sue somebody. Suing Apple makes sense if Apple does the logical thing and pulls out of Norway. Apple might then have legitimate grounds to sue the labels for business interference, especially if Amazon et al. are allowed to continue to sell unfettered in Norway.
There are some ugly questions that a lawsuit raises that the labels have been trying to ignore. Does Norway have enough purchasing power to make up for the “losses” that they are sure they will incur from DRM-less media? How about all of Europe if the EUC becomes involved? Are they willing to trade one juggernaut (Apple) for another (Amazon)? What if European artists rebel and sign onto iTunes as independents? If the labels give Apple dispensation to sell unfettered in Norway, will other nations realize that they can blackmail their way into a DRM-free service?
Fun times, indeed.
I suggest you stick to ranting about American issues. In order for consumer protection legislation to do its thing and actually be legislation that protects consumers, it must be restrictive to business. Our laws mandate that all sales are final and binding and result in a transfer of ownership. I have bought a song and obtained a copyright licence for it. Whether Apple applied copy protection to it voluntarily or not, they have no business restricting what I do to it after the sale, as long as I use it personally. Apple chose to do business and make money in our countries, and are thus subject to our laws.
Oh, and fuck you too!
Oh look, a fucking whiny norski is again showing they don’t know what the fuck is going on.
Tell me, what part of: “The decision to require DRM on some songs is not Apple’s, you fucking ignoramus” is unclear to you?
Apple has been trying for some time now, as shown by iTunes Plus, to dump DRM. The record companies won’t let them.
Exactly how is Apple supposed to unilaterally abrogate a contract without losing all the songs on iTMS and paying an assload of money?
Is everyone in Norway as fucking ignorant as you, or are you just the only village idiot with an internet connection?
@Dan Villiom Podlaski Christiansen:
Then your laws, you fuckwit, are broken.
Oh, and since apparently the whiny twats in the EU need a reminder, here are Steve’s words on the subject:
@The Angry Drunk:
Oh now you want these fucksticks to analyze the problem and try to fix the root cause? What next, you’re trading in your car for a flying ponycorn?
Not everyone in Norway is that fucking ignorant, but we do have more than our share of entitletards, I’m afraid.
Oh, and go angry, loudmouthed guys! Always entertaining, and mostly spot on.
I hate to say it but:
“Sovereign nation, they make the laws.”
I disagree with the way that Norway is going after Apple (especially since everyone but EMI is refusing DRM-free tracks on iTunes while allowing them for any other online retailer – most likely an effect of an industry in collusion to kill Apple’s online stranglehold and reinforce their own power, but I digress somewhat and greatly over-extend this parenthesis) but (takes breath) they can make any damn stupid laws they like and enforce them. That’s what being a sovereign nation is all about.
Of course, the worst result for Norway’s people is if Apple just kill their iTunes Music Store. It seems the only remaining viable option, given that the regulators lack the testicles to actually hit the music companies whose contracts with Apple are definitely within Norway’s legal system, and therefore subject to Norway’s regulation. No, much simpler to go after Apple who are bound by the laws of Norway and the contracts they sign to get the business.
I read some guy on ArsTechnica a while back who vociferously maintained that Apple are in the wrong for *signing the contracts*. For anyone who argues that – if the contracts are legal to start with, the nation in question is similarly bound to honour them and not change the system or object after the fact. If the contracts were never legal to start with, then there’s no fault and the nation in question will object to (and assist in the defence of) any penalty being attempted by a party that considers itself wronged.
But no, it’s so much simpler to put it all at Apple’s door. Damn those greedy Americans and all that! Why try for a real solution when there’s political mileage (or kilometreage) to be made from hitting the obvious parties?
(Full disclosure: I’m Australian and used the Mac since 1992. I try not to be a fan-boy and attempt to engage my brain on political issues.)
@John C. Welch: What makes our consumer legislation effective is that it deals with relationship between the seller and purchaser exclusively. That is, Apple is the store selling these products, and thus responsible for them. Apple can deal with its partners themselves; they’re in a much better position to do that. Our laws constitute the frame within businesses must operate; claiming that you had no choice is irrelevant in this regard. These laws work for every other area of business, and will work for this area too. The Consumer Ombudsman is targeting Apple as the most significant player. If necessary, other players will be dealt with later.
You guys seem very happy to condemn this as Anti-American behaviour, yet you know absolutely nothing about the countries you are charging of it. If you did, you would know that such a claim is ridiculous, and reveals that you haven’t looked into the issue beyond what you hear from American media. On the other hand, it never ceases to amaze when an American business try to do business in Europe just as they do in America, only to be surprised when their unreasonable or illegal behaviour gets them into trouble.
Apart from the usual Scandinavian partners, Germany and France are also supportive of the Norwegian inquiries. Pulling out of those markets would be downright stupid…
@Dan Villiom Podlaski Christiansen:
Bullshit.
This is just a politician making political points by catering to a bunch of whining twats like you with an overblown sense of entitlement. Tell me, is your precious defender of consumer justice also attacking Microsoft because the Zune marketplace is Zune only; or attacking Sony because PS3 discs don’t play in a Wii? Didn’t fucking think so.
And cut the “oh, evil Americans are oppressing me” crap. Do a little more reading here and you’ll notice that I’m hardly a cheerleader for this country, or for unregulated markets. What I do oppose, in every form, is the asinine notion that Apple (or any other company) is required to make its offerings interoperable with it’s competitors. If you don’t want to use an iPod, then fine buy your music from one of the nigh infinite alternate sources out there. In the meantime, suck a dick.
@Dan Villiom Podlaski Christiansen:
Dude, the contract, implied or otherwise makes no difference. They can scream and yell and sue Apple all they want, and it won’t matter, because apple can’t change the contract unilaterally. What they’re doing is the equivalent of demanding that an auto dealer sell all models at the same price. The dealer cannot unilaterally do that. They can only control the items they have control over. I fail to see why this very basic concept is impossible for you to understand.
Apple is not the entity requiring DRM in their store. In fact, where they can, the happily sell DRM-free songs. But if their supplier, who actually controls this situation requires them to apply DRM, then Apple has no choice, barring not doing business with that supplier anymore.
Going after Apple may be emotionally satisfying, but it has no chance of fixing the problem, because Apple is not the cause here.
As far as the anti-american issue goes, um, reading skills? This has nothing to do with country of origin, and everything to do with stupidity. Bitching at Apple when you’re aware that Apple is not the source of the problem is stupid. Just because an American is pointing out that stupidity doesn’t make it not stupid. It just means you can’t be fucking bothered to do your own work.
It is the stupidity that is annoying. The source has nothing to do with beyond the fact that people who eat lutefisk should not be calling anyone names.
*whistles a merry little iTune*
I wonder if I should seek political asylum in Sweden. They have cheap smokes, cheap booze, cheap beer, cheap anything that is unhealthy, and the girls are almost as cute as here. I am rather sure the überhaubtstürmführer herr Ombudsmann Thon has had a constant erection ever since he found out that he might make himself internationally known. Ohhhhhhh well. iPods without iTunes Music Store is really a party. I am old enough to remember the times before it opened here, we actually had to go to town to get our CDs. Wasn’t fun at all. All the penguins and walruses tried to gnaw off our kneecaps, and if that didn’t kill us, it didn’t make us tougher either. Bloody bastardness.
@Dan Villiom Podlaski Christiansen:
Uhm… Where the fuck did you see them condemning this as Anti-American behaviour? Last time I checked, this was not Jack D. Ripper’s blog.
Hey, I just got told penguins come from the south pole, not the north pole (apparently it’s in antiartica) so, damn, I feel like a fool now. My cogent point just got undermined by my ignorance. Good job no-one else here made the same mistake. You must all be right.
A few points:
1) There is no Zune marketplace in Scandinavia. The other, smaller stores will likely be dealt with after Apple.
2) The ombudsman is a civil servant directly appointed by the minister. He is not a politician, and not an elected official. If Norway is like Denmark in this area — generally a reasonable assumption — only parliamentarians and local council members are elected.
3) Any contract is based on the law, and the law defines the premises of the contract. Apple can enter into a contract to break the law all they want; they’ll still be breaking the law. Whomever Apple promised to not really sell music is irrelevant. The music was sold, so Apple is bound by local laws.
4) In general, it is obvious that you guys are completely ignorant about how the Scandinavian societies are modelled. Even expert knowledge of American society is not sufficient to criticise European societies; knowledge of what you
5) Encryption is not the only factor preventing interoperability between the Wii and the PS3. Encryption is the only factor that prevents me from playing some of my music on my phone. (Which otherwise sucks.)
6) Neither Norway nor Sweden have cheap smokes and booze. On the contrary, actually.
This is about whether certain behaviour is legal and permissible in our markets. You have no idea about the context, and say nothing which other equally uninformed Americans haven’t already said. I was wrong to generalise this to saying that Norway was anti-American, and I apologise for that. That being said, you guys seem unaware of the fact that you know nothing whatsoever about Scandinavia.
(Friday. One out of two. Sigh.)
@Dan Villiom Podlaski Christiansen:
None of which will address the root cause of the problem, because you don’t care, as long as you get to rail against the evil american corporation keeping you from your rightful music.
Not if Apple has no contracts with music companies. How well do you think iTunes will do sans content?
A bureaucrat making a name for himself with a bunch of PR based on complete ignorance of reality. Wow, THERE’S a shock. Just like…well…the U.S. Except here, we try to avoid electionless power outside of the judiciary.
So let me understand this. All contracts that you don’t like are illegal. And, according to you, neither Apple, nor the European branches of the various record companies have no local lawyers, nor bothered to look up local laws, and based everything off of the American bar?
Because that’s what you’re saying. That companies with actual offices in the EU, and Norway, who employ nationals of the various EU/Scandanavian countries, in fact, *have no idea of the local laws*?
Does it maybe occur to you that possibly, your interpretation of this is oh…i don’t know…fucking stupid? Because that’s what I’m seeing, is a complete lack of awareness of how multinational companies work, combined with the idea that no one but you knows shit about Norway.
However, in a vain attempt to bring logic into this, what’s the difference between not being able to play a song from the iTMS on any device you want, and being able to put a Saab piston into any car you want? In Norway, are car companies required by law to have interchangeable parts? Because that’s a direct analogy. All parts in any industry must be effortlessly interchangeable. A song is just a part of the online music industry, and you’re demanding that they be made in a perfectly interchangeable manner. So can I buy a cheap-shit VW in Norway, and replace various parts with high-end Saab parts, and they’ll all fit and work perfectly? There’s no technical reason for that not being allowed.
Somehow I doubt I can do that.
I know how to finish a sentence. As well, your assumption that all americans know nothing about any country other than their own shows your rather astounding ignorance of the breadth and depth of people in this country. Here’s a hint…Fox News is not all you need to watch. Maybe you should spend some time learning about Americans before you decide what we do and do not know. It certainly beats that blind fortune teller who’s supplying your information at the moment.
Well, there’s a significant hardware difference between a Zune and an iPod and a Sansa, even though they all do the same thing. Why do you allow Nintendo and Sony to use incompatible disk formats and APIs. there’s no reason why you can’t play the same game on both, in fact, the presence of multiplatform games shows there is no technical reason why this can’t happen.
As well, you do keep ignoring the fact that Apple is trying to get rid of DRM, but the record companies won’t let them. Oh, wait, that’s one of those inconvenient “facts” that you’re so studiously ignoring. You’ve made up your mind, why should facts be allowed to confuse you.
If you’re representative of Norwegian men, I feel bad for the women, because it must cost them a fortune to get blasted enough to where you’re not an ignorant, self-important douchebag.
No, we keep pointing out that Apple is not the root cause of this problem, and you keep ignoring that because it’s inconvenient for your worldview.
And your ignorance of the USA appears to be far greater than your perceived, (and incorrect) opinion of our ignorance of Norway. (Scandinavia is a region, not a country. While Finland, Norway, and Sweden share a great deal of common history, they are not in fact the same place. Since we’re talking about the actions of a minor unelected public official in one country, let’s not drag the other two into it.)
Once again, John manages to make my point even better than I can.
Then again, I’m a borderline sociopathic alcoholic, so what’re you gonna do.
The thing is, over the course of the last few days; our buddy Dan has only managed to put forth one argument. Simply put that argument is, “Norwegian law says…”
And right there is where I cease to give a crap. See; I really don’t care what the law says. Sometime laws are wrong. To take this to the hyperbolic extreme, in Saudi Arabia, female rape victims are considered adulterers, and by Saudi law are punished by flogging. This is the law, it’s also wrong. To show I’m a standup guy and bash on good old America for a bit; there are many states here with laws that state that love between two people of the same biological sex is illegal. That’s wrong too.
All ‘m saying, all I’ve ever said is: no one, whether they be in Norway, America, or the Land of fucking Oz, has a right to perfect interoperability. If you don’t like Apple’s horrid monopoly on the iTunes Music Store; then I suggest that you check out Amazon, or eMusic, or (heavens forbid) your local CD shop. You will be amazed that all of these sources work perfectly on the “closed” iPod platform.
@Dan
The ciggies in Sweden are cheap compared to Norway… That was my point.